1. Welcome to the shiny new site! Please have a look around and let us know how its working for you. Please note that all returning members will need to reset your passwords to login again. Click on "forgot password" to reset your password. If you still have issues then email us at board@marinecolorado.org Thanks
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Site Upgrade complete! A new version of the forum software has been uploaded. Please let us know if you have any issues. Thanks

The future of our hobby

Discussion in 'General Reefkeeping Discussion' started by scchase, Sep 4, 2014.

  1. sethsolomon

    sethsolomon Shark M.A.S.C Club Member

    I think what the hobbyists are shooting for is posting them as threatened and not endangered. This will allow for the private transactions of coral and will only make them extremely controlled to import.

    Posting them as endangered will FUBAR the hobby as we know it today.
  2. jda123

    jda123 Tuna M.A.S.C Club Member

    Only in the US and other countries that care. They will still be collected and sold to other places.

    They need a new classification that stops wild collection but allows growth and propagation of previously collected individuals. I have enough Lokani and Microladus to repopulate a small part of the ocean, it seems...

    They will only be threatened until the perfect summer comes and they are everywhere again - look at the fish and coral in Hawaii this year. I think that it is foolish to think that every year brings a banner crop and that maybe one year in ten produces tons of specimens... same is true with wild livestock where hash winters and dry summers bring no offspring those years, but in mild years everybody has babies everywhere.
  3. bmb527

    bmb527 Amphipod

    Hey all,
    I have been a member since this was the Rocky Mountain Reef Club, but have lived out of state in Seattle for the past 6 years. Well, I am back bi@$hes!!!! I had enough rain and tree huggers.
    ...Back to the topic of this thread:
    I have seen this exact same thing happen to the reptile hobby as well. I was involved in a herpetology group in WA and what we did is to meet with the representatives for our area and invite them to a meeting or 10. We took them to the facilities of some well known and proper breeders to show that it is being done properly without taking from wild stocks. With so many excellent folks in the hobby in THIS AREA....we could quite possibly get the word buzzing around capital hill that it is not the hobby screwing things up. Hell, Ki at Key's Island has been doing aquaculturing of his stuff since before I got into the hobby in 2002. There are many of us that have fantastic, sterile setups right in our homes. We need to enlighten these politicians to how this hobby really works and that we are getting to be more of a closed loop society in that we swap and sell among our peers and less taking from the wild. There are some fantastic reef clubs I have visited in this country, MASC, Manhattan Reef Club, Louisiana Reef Club just to name a few.
    We just need to get some "official" eyes on what we do, and spread the word. 2 years ago, my then 8 year old decided to do a nano reef and document every step throughout a year for her science project. For the science fair, I broke the 14 gallon tank down, and set it back up in the auditorium at her school. We set up 12 boards with photos and descriptions of everything in the tank, along with a 22 inch TV with a video of the entire process. She won 1st prize, and even better, I had parents contacting me for a year to learn about the beautiful reef tank hobby and to help them set them up in their homes.
    We need to do outreach projects, set up tanks and show people what we do. We need to get the word out so we can stop the destruction of our hobby.
  4. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

  5. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

  6. Matt_Arian

    Matt_Arian Copepod

    Another article on the Banggai Cardinal being listed. Major point on this one; over harvesting for the aquarium trade can be/is being offset by captive breeding programs.

    In other words, time to bust out the broodstock and rearing tanks and dust off the plankton culturing apparatus.
  7. SynDen

    SynDen Shark Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. M.A.S.C President M.A.S.C Webmaster

  8. LeviK

    LeviK SCMAS Board Members S.C.M.A.S BOD

    I agree completely. This whole call to arms imo, is a scare tactic from businesses that are afraid of losing profits. We should be fighting for the exclusion of "frags" instead of trying to get something deemed not endangered is not going to happen if it is in fact endangered in the wild.
  9. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

    Exclusion is the only way to go right now IMO, though I believe the businesses have a point as well, without exclusions I firmly believe that all Acropora and Euphyllia trade will be shut down. The officers responsible for doing inspections at customs have no idea how to id corals to a species level and neither do most hobbyists. As a result I believe that without exclusions the course of action that willb e taken is a blanket exclusion of all species in a genus rather than by species.
    As to the other portion about not sensationalizing things, I would have to be in disagreement, I do not think that it is a good tactic overall but since the primary opponents of the aquarium trade have already gone there and gained the media attention that has made pending legislation in places like Hawaii possible the ship has basically already sailed and the only way to fight fire is fire in this case.
  10. jda123

    jda123 Tuna M.A.S.C Club Member

    If all of this means that I find another hobby (or more likely limit this one), then I am OK with it if some real scientists decide that there is a real reason to stop the trade and import for the sake of the wild creatures. I don't raise baby California Condors or Pandas either.

    However, if these things get changed by sensationalists or people with their own agenda, then that will suck. Fortunately, the NMFS probably has balance on both sides and will do their job independently.

    I would like to know how the recent banner crop of Pacific fish is affecting people's judgement on stuff. Reefs are almost too full of fish this year and might be for a while. Perhaps thinking needs to change to more cyclical thinking where new acros/fish/whatever only have really good conditions ever 8-10 years instead of expecting things yearly. This happens with all livestock where people don't provide/raise for them.
  11. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

  12. TheRealChrisBrown

    TheRealChrisBrown Barracuda Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

  13. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

  14. SynDen

    SynDen Shark Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. M.A.S.C President M.A.S.C Webmaster

    Hawaii always been pretty hard line on corals though, but the line just got moved.... :(
  15. Irishman

    Irishman Cuttle Fish M.A.S.C Club Member

    Is there a list of what fish come from Hawii?
  16. SynDen

    SynDen Shark Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. M.A.S.C President M.A.S.C Webmaster

    yellow tangs is the big one but also;
    powder browns
    Cross hatch trigger
    humu humu
    moorish idol
    several varieties of angels
    Just to name a few.

    Many can be found elsewhere, but...
  17. SantaMonicaHelp

    SantaMonicaHelp Copepod

    It's really strange to imagine a future where reefkeeping is outlawed, but perhaps it's not too far out there. I suppose only time will tell.

  18. jda123

    jda123 Tuna M.A.S.C Club Member

    All of those fish can be captured in international waters. ...it will take time to figure out how to get them to Marshalls or somewhere else for export. There are folks in Hawaii with their commercial fishing license that can still collect, just not with small nets - this will impact a lot of wrasses and stuff, but not probably anything on that list in post 76.

    I am still getting stock lists with YT, crosshatches, humas and flame angelfish on them.
  19. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

    SantaMonicaHelp and SynDen like this.
  20. scchase

    scchase Marlin Staff Member M.A.S.C Club Member M.A.S.C. B.O.D. B.O.D. Member-at-Large

    Time for another sad update, effective Jan 1st all live rock and coral exports from Fiji have been suspended indefinitely, this is significant because nearly all (all?) live rock and coral from Fiji comes from Walt Smith International and is farmed or maricultured, the coral that is not farmed is replaced one for one by maricultured corals from the farm resulting in nearly no net loss from the reef. The following is a statement for Walt Smith

    Walt Smith International (Fiji) Ltd founded in 1995 in Navutu has been forced to lay off over 3/4 of our staff due to the sudden ban of coral & rock exports in Fiji. While we have scientific evidence that for the past 20 years our sustainability and support for the reefs has proven successful, there is some miscommunications going around concerning the harvest and export of coral and rock. We have made contact with the Minister of Fisheries, and are taking immediate action to restore our business and jobs to the hundreds of locals and businesses that this industry supports bringing in over $10 million dollars of badly needed export revenue.

    We personally regret having to take this action but see no current options as we have been unable to obtain a CITES since the end of December.

    We have teamed up with the local CITES Management Authority as well as the Scientific Council and the Fiji Commerce & Employers Federation as well as other businesses affected by the ban. Walt is presenting crucial scientific data and relevant information to those making the decisions about Fiji's export permits.

    Being the Pioneer of Coral farming, and having over 50,000 coral frags planted in the ocean yearly we understand the need for concern and fully support sustainable harvest.

    Several years ago Walt also started a non-profit ADEProject.org that is solely dedicated to sustaining and restoring the reefs in Fiji while bringing an income to the villages that participate, however without the current ability to continue our business we will not be able to fully support this initiative.

    We hope all the affected employees, villages and suppliers understand our current situation and we are urgently working to get back to work with what we sustainably know how to do.

    Love and prayers
    Walt, Deb and Dave

Share This Page