Input on my return setup...

[ShelbyJK500]

So this is how I set up the return to my large tank. I'm thinking it wasn't as good of an idea as first thought. The pipes run down the center which could/may cause issues with lighting. Looking for ideas to re-do this. If i'm gonna do it, I have to do it this weekend before I put salt in it and officially start it up.

Should I tee straight to the sides and then down to the corners? Any other ideas that won't require new projects?? FYI, it plumbs to the overflow box at 1 1/2" and I reduced it to 1". I was/still am planning on reducing the 1" to 3/4" threaded so I can get loc line nozzles on it at all four corners. Here's the pics...

 

[Craigar]

You could turn your t the other way and run it to each side then t it to each corner to help on lighting the only problem is the more bend the less pressure/flow due to resistance


300 gallon mixed reef
90 gallon bowfront fowlr

 

[Walter White]

Just my opinion but I would just plumb the returns over the edged of the overflow facing out on both sites towards the ends of the tank rather than coming all the way across and pointing inward. Then use either Vortechs or some Tuzes on each end facing back toward the center. That way you should have excellent flow in all directions and not have to worry about all the plumbing getting in the way and obstructing the light. Just my two cents!

 

[jagermeister]

I don't think you want that current setup as you're right, it will block your lighting. Why so many returns? General rule of thumb is to have 3x to 5x tank volume turnover through your sump. Some advocate as low as 1x tank volume turnover through the sump. More than these values and you risk noise issues and reduced contact time with filter media and a skimmer.

All water movement within the tank should come from powerheads. A few powerheads are generally cheaper to run than a bigger return pump.

You might think about lowering your 'T' in the over flow box and then just coming right out of the overflow box on each side with your locline. So in total, 2 locline return nozzels, one on each side of the overflow box.

hth.

 

[Walter White]

+1

 

[djkms]

Yeah I agree with Kris, just run a couple flow accelerators coming out each long side of the overflow facing outward. Sometimes KISS is the best method

 

[ShelbyJK500]

You could turn your t the other way and run it to each side then t it to each corner to help on lighting the only problem is the more bend the less pressure/flow due to resistance

That was my first thought, to reconfigure it the way you just mentioned. I don't have to worry about flow. It appears the pump is more than enough for both tanks, which I didn't think it was going to be that powerful! The only remaining concern with this setup would be whatever canopy I get done for the top...making sure it won't interfere with how it will sit on the tank. Which is a perfect segue to me needing to get in touch with you again. If you need to come see the tank reference possibly building me something...let me know. I don't have any plans through tomorrow.

 

[ShelbyJK500]

Just my opinion but I would just plumb the returns over the edged of the overflow facing out on both sites towards the ends of the tank rather than coming all the way across and pointing inward. Then use either Vortechs or some Tuzes on each end facing back toward the center. That way you should have excellent flow in all directions and not have to worry about all the plumbing getting in the way and obstructing the light. Just my two cents!

I LIKE this idea as well. Only two issues. 1) The overflow box is just too long that it would prevent me from plumbing down on its side because the braces are in the way. I'd have to extend out and go over the braces. I don't know if that would be an issue at all?? 2) I plan on using two LARGE Seio's that I have on hand at the wall side of the tank to push water. I didn't want to run anything on the other side of the tank simply for aesthetics. Not sure if I could get away with only running the nozzles, Seio's and nothing coming from the other side??

Yeah I agree with Kris, just run a couple flow accelerators coming out each long side of the overflow facing outward. Sometimes KISS is the best method

Ironic I actually have two of those accelerators still in their packaging. Not sure if I would need that much "acceleration" though. If I cut my flow down to two return's, it's going to be pretty powerful. I don't want to put too much backpressure on the pump...unless that isn't an issue??

 

[djkms]

I have my Mag18's flow cut down more than 1/2 to combat noise (any louder and I feel like I live at Waterworld) without issue.

 

[ShelbyJK500]

reply...

I don't think you want that current setup as you're right, it will block your lighting. Why so many returns? I guess I have four returns simply because I knew the pump was up to the task. Also, since this is "planned" to be a FOWLR tank several people mentioned I could probably get away with almost no power heads using this configuration. I actually planned on putting dual nozzles on each end for a total of 8 nozzles. However, I'm researching on whether I can get away with a mixed reef and still have the corals and fish I'd like. That's the short answer!

General rule of thumb is to have 3x to 5x tank volume turnover through your sump. Some advocate as low as 1x tank volume turnover through the sump. More than these values and you risk noise issues and reduced contact time with filter media and a skimmer.

So being new, I have no idea how to calculate that. I'm assuming it would just be a complete guesstimate? Would I have estimate my head loss, pump power, etc? Might not be the easiest thing since I have two tanks plumbed to the same sump and as such, both tanks get their return from the pump. I will "think" the flow is fairly high...but I don't have many other people's setups to base this on. I also have a refugium that will have a DSB, live rock, macro and pods with much lower flow, that will dump into the sump. That should help with exposure to media some.

All water movement within the tank should come from powerheads. A few powerheads are generally cheaper to run than a bigger return pump.

Just curious being new...if this is true, how come so many people run closed loops for their flow??

You might think about lowering your 'T' in the over flow box and then just coming right out of the overflow box on each side with your locline. So in total, 2 locline return nozzels, one on each side of the overflow box.

Are you talking about drilling through the overflow box and putting the returns there? If so I think that would be way too problematic to re-configure my bean-animal setup. I definitely thought of that in the beginning. I think I wasn't even able to get a drill in there with a bit attached based on space. IIRC

hth.

 

[ShelbyJK500]

I have my Mag18's flow cut down more than 1/2 to combat noise (any louder and I feel like I live at Waterworld) without issue.

LOL...yeah, the hammerhead even in the basement is causing some noise "issues". Once the base of my large tank is skinned I will probably lose a good amount of the noise. However, the basement does sound like Waterworld.

 

[jagermeister]

So being new, I have no idea how to calculate that. I'm assuming it would just be a complete guesstimate? Would I have estimate my head loss, pump power, etc? Might not be the easiest thing since I have two tanks plumbed to the same sump and as such, both tanks get their return from the pump. I will "think" the flow is fairly high...but I don't have many other people's setups to base this on. I also have a refugium that will have a DSB, live rock, macro and pods with much lower flow, that will dump into the sump. That should help with exposure to media some.

Well, you'd start of determining how much flow you want through your sump. You might choose 3x turnover of your display so then you have your needed flow rate. You can then look for pumps that will deliver that flow rate. I think there's even some online calculators that you can play around with that you can input your piping system and required flow rate and they'll spit out a list of pumps that will work. Then you'd probably choose the pump that worked with your system using the least energy. But it sounds like you may already have your pump. The ultimate high tech way of determining the flow rate through your sump is to get a 5 gallon bucket and see how long it takes to fill it up from the drain of your main tank. You can then adjust the flow rate of your return pump to achieve your wanted flow.

Just curious being new...if this is true, how come so many people run closed loops for their flow??

Sorry, you can include closed loops in with efficient ways to add flow to your tank. I didn't think of them when I wrote that.

Are you talking about drilling through the overflow box and putting the returns there? If so I think that would be way too problematic to re-configure my bean-animal setup. I definitely thought of that in the beginning. I think I wasn't even able to get a drill in there with a bit attached based on space. IIRC

No, it looks like your 'T' is well above the height of the overflow box. A lot of overflow boxes have a notch you can break out on the top to fit a return pipe. I assumed your overflow box had these and you could just run your returns that way. But it sounds like your box may not have those notches.

I don't want to put too much backpressure on the pump...unless that isn't an issue??

Nope, it's not an issue. Pumps like back pressure.

 

[ShelbyJK500]

reply...

Well, you'd start of determining how much flow you want through your sump. You might choose 3x turnover of your display so then you have your needed flow rate. You can then look for pumps that will deliver that flow rate. I think there's even some online calculators that you can play around with that you can input your piping system and required flow rate and they'll spit out a list of pumps that will work. Then you'd probably choose the pump that worked with your system using the least energy. But it sounds like you may already have your pump. The ultimate high tech way of determining the flow rate through your sump is to get a 5 gallon bucket and see how long it takes to fill it up from the drain of your main tank. You can then adjust the flow rate of your return pump to achieve your wanted flow.

Yup...already have the pump...so I think I'll apply the ultimate high tech measurement, courtesy of home depot!

No, it looks like your 'T' is well above the height of the overflow box. A lot of overflow boxes have a notch you can break out on the top to fit a return pipe. I assumed your overflow box had these and you could just run your returns that way. But it sounds like your box may not have those notches.

Correct, my overflow box was custom built and does not have those notches. Without creating more projects to slow my process down, I'm wondering if just plumbing over and down close to the box and then using nozzles from there is the trick?? If I had a Dremel, I could probably make a "notch" but not too fond of new tricks that could lead to more problems to solve at the moment.


Nope, it's not an issue. Pumps like back pressure.

Great to hear. I assumed that logic would say the pump would work harder with the constriction. If not, probably a good idea since I think my flow/turnover rate is quite high at the moment. Thanks again for all the input!!