Help!!! Ich??

J

jda123

Dolphin
M.A.S.C Club Member
#21
#21
Temp just speeds up the life cycle and might make the ich drop off the fish faster. I don't think that it actually kills it, but I could be wrong.

I do firmly believe that the garlic will give the fish some relief, but it will not kill the ich.

The Leopards will likely die in QT since they don't do hypo very well and you cannot really do copper in a tank with a sandbed. I have never seen any ich on any of my leopards - do yours show signs of it?

Unless you run fallow, then you will still have ich in the tank. I am nearly positive that I have some in both of my tanks even though I QT all (most) fish, but none of them have any signs - I do not qt my corals. I would just wait until your current fish get over their issues and then drop the QT fish in there. I only QT them to get them strong, used to captivity and eating pellets which I can soak in garlic - sure, I use some Cupramine in there too, but they will need to be able to fight it off in the display and they nearly always do. Even if a fish has a minor relapse in the display, the other fish are unaffected.

Does anybody in this town keep coral only in their coral systems and run copper with their fish? I would make it a point to shop there more. I know that this does not guarantee anything, but it sure helps out a bunch.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

Reef Shark
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#22
#22
Leapords are fine, no flashing, no spots and eating like pigs.
 
F

FinsUp

According to my watch, the time is now.
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#23
#23
I've been told that wrasses have thicker slime coats and so are less prone to suffer from 'skin' problems.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

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#24
#24
UPDATE

Temp has been slowly raised and is now sitting at 83. Going to closely monitor the next few days at this temp to see how things do.

No losses, all fish are doing fine. The only fish showing any signs of ich was a naked clown, hes been removed and placed in qt, his own 10 gallon, being treated with cupramine.

Girlfriend is not happy, but i also picked up a 55gal yesterday and got it running as a new QT tank! I put the trigger in there for observation, no cupramine as she doesnt seem to be infected. The wrasses do not and have not seemed to be affected at all. I think Cindy's statement above must be correct, so ive keft them in the DT.

Im hoping not to kill the ich with the high temp but to stop its reproductive stage, in which it will die off in its own life cycle.

I wont be adding anything to the DT for a while :( but thats ok, it gives me time to focus on my clown breeding oroject ive been trying to get going!!

More updates to come.
 
Andrew_bram

Andrew_bram

Tiger Shark
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#25
#25
Help!!! Ich??

Please keep in mind freshwater ich and saltwater ich is two completely different animals. Even though wrasses may not show signs of ich they will still be carriers. While it is true there slime coats may prevent from bonding that does nothing from the gills being infected. Copper,hypo,freshwater dips and tank changes, or cp are known to be effective.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

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#26
#26
I didnt think wrasses did good with copper or hypo?? Ive never freshwater dipped, and im doing large weekly water changes. Not adding any chemicals to the DT, the coral is way more valuable than the fish unfortunately.

The point to my experiment is too keep the parasite from reproducing. Sure, it may live for a while but not forever, and without reproduction it will eventually die off. Everything i have read about it says it reproduces between low 70s and low 80s, im shooting to hit 84.5, which i believe is safe as well.

Since jumping to 83, my corals look happier, fuller and healthier than ever!
 
Andrew_bram

Andrew_bram

Tiger Shark
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#27
#27
Help!!! Ich??

I understand your point. But solely research based saltwater ich does not respond to temp. Hence why I was trying to give you some alternatives. Bob fener as a lot of info on the topic. Just trying to help.
 
Cake_Boss

Cake_Boss

Blue Whale
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#28
#28
Re: Help!!! Ich??

The only possible thing you can do to treat the tank like you want is a combo of UV and a diatom filter.

From my recent experience, remove the coral and inverts or remove the fish. If you really want to stop this now, do one of these two options. Then treat fish. You can do whatever you'd like best, I'm convinced on CP (chloroquine phosphate) though. I have some FREE for you when I get back home. You cannot treat this with corals and inverts, as it will def kill both.

PM me if you want to arrange a meeting place.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

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#29
#29
UPDATE: Since my last post temp has held steady at 85 with no isses to fish or corals what so ever. All wrasses, chromis, the puffer, and dottybacks were all left in the DT as they didnt seem to be infected and I didnt have room for them in QT. all fish are still doing fine and not showing any signs of the parasite. Ive lost absloluty no live stock thus far.

The clown, nor the trigger exhibit any signs of the parasite but are still in QT just in case, temp in QT is also 85 and I have stopped dosing cupramine to see how it goes.

I had a very lengthy skype conversation the other night with Chingchai Uekrongtham (if your not fimilair with him look his reef tanks up). Ive been trying to reach him via email for the past few days as its an article I read regarding his tank that made me want to try the temperature thing and was finally able to connect with him via skype. HIs observation is basically the same as mine so I will continue to do exactly what I am doing in the DT to kill the parasite, which is high temperature so it cannot re produce. I know its way to early to tell for sure, but this really does seem to be working. I have another experiment up my sleeve as per the reccomendation of ChingChai to better test if the parasite has infact been eradicated from the DT, more details on that to come.

I will keep you posted.
 
kio707

kio707

Tang
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#32
#32
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

Reef Shark
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#36
#36
UPDATE: 3 weeks since last post and no signs of ICH. I have held the temp at about 85 this entire time. NO more losses, no out breaks. The clown and pink tail remain in QT alone being treadted with copper, but none of the fish I left in the DT have shown any signs at all. Im going to wait a few more weeks and then add a cheap fish to the DT to see what happens.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

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#37
#37
andyrm66;246129 said:
How will you know that you really got rid of all the ich in the DT?
Click to expand...
By stopping the reproductive cycle of the parasite with the elevated temp. In order to survive they have to re produce every few weeks. After reporduction the "cysts" become free floating and begin to look for a host. IF they cannot find a host they will die. Im monitoring this by looking for a new break out. If nothing has become re infected within the 10 weeks I plan on monitoring this for I feel very confident the parasite has died.
 
Ahhshoot

Ahhshoot

Blenny
M.A.S.C Club Member
#38
#38
Great news man. I just went through the same thing you did but I have lost most of my fish, I still have 3 left that are in QT. This is my 3rd run in with Ich and it has frustrated me so much that I have decided to take a break from the hobby for about a year. I am selling everything, 180G tank and all! Good luck with the rest of your battle. I think you're now winning the war...congrats!
 
A

andyrm66

Butterfly Fish
#39
#39
Probably sped up the life cycle, many sources quote MI living in water up to 90 so I highly doubt it completely got rid of it. If the temp keeps it at bay for you, that's better than sitting idly by and doing nothing, if any of the proven methods cant be done for your fish.
 
ReefCheif

ReefCheif

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#40
#40
UPDATE: Im at week nine since starting this experiment. All fish that were moved to QT have been re intorduced to the DT about 2 weeks ago. Since then I have also added new live stock, 5 firefish, mated pair of cinnamon clown (have laid eggs twice), purple sided fairy wrasse, 3 cleaner wrasses, 2 green scats and2 engineer gobies. All existing fish have not shown any signs of infection at all, the new fish added to the DT were QTd for 4 weeks (green scats still in QT) in a system that runs copper and intorduced to the DT ove the past 2 weeks. No new additions are showing any signs of infections and everything is doing quite well.

Not to boast, but to those of you who said this wouldnt work, Id like to say you were wrong and every good idea with a little research deserves a chance. I can say this is tried and tested and works. I know of reefers in Thailand who have used this same method with much success, its actually where I got the idea from. I used absolutly no chemicals to cure the ich (other than in the QT i use for new fish, but none of my infected live stock were added to this tank as its only used for new fish), I added absolutly nothing to the tank except for water changes and elevated the temperature significantly. Heavy soakings of garlic for feedings and a varitey of things being fed to boost the immune system.

I am 100% confident the ich is completley gone from my DT.

I will keep the temperature elevated for another month or so just to be sure and then I will start re adding my tangs, I think this will be the true test to find out if the ich is gone or not, but as of now I feel very comfortable I have won this battle with minimal losses and may drop a yellow tang in soon just to see how it goes.
 
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